Is Gay Marriage a Threat to Religious Freedom? – John Corvino

Is Gay Marriage a Threat to Religious Freedom? – John Corvino

Opponents of same-sex marriage often argue that allowing gays to marry would threaten the religious freedom of those who oppose such unions. Here, John …



47 Comments on “Is Gay Marriage a Threat to Religious Freedom? – John Corvino”

  1. Pt. 2 — with you. There are already protections in place that allow you to condemn gay people to your heart's content. It's just that in some state that have anti-discrimination laws in place, you're not allowed to discriminate against gays if you own a business or offer public accommodation. If you run a B&B or a bakery you can't refuse to serve gays due to your "deeply held religious beliefs," just as you can't refuse to serve black people or Jews. In turn, gays can't refuse service to you.

  2. Pt. 1 — It's you who doesn't get it. Gay or straight, our lives are not defined by our "sexual preference." We all have wants, needs, dreams and aspirations, regardless of our sexual preference. Some of us want to get married. Others don't. If I want to marry another man it should not be up to the state to decide whether or not I'm allowed to.

    Same-sex marriage is not a "threat to religious freedom" Joe. That's just a red herring that Chritianists have been using to scare people into siding

  3. Wrong again Joe. Civil unions = separate but not equal. I've been married to my husband for 10 years, and we've been together for more than 25 years. We don't care if you or society accepts our relationship, nor are we trying to "punish" you for beliefs. You don't accept me, and I don't accept people like you who are living your chosen lifestyle. We were born gay. You weren't born a christian. That was your choice. It's not up to me to judge, no matter how misguided and deluded I think you are.

  4. "We, as a society, have rejected homosexuality." I guessed you missed the part where the world around you changed. The majority of Americans now support gays and marriage equality. With the younger set, approval is at an all time high, in excess of 70%. Minnesota rejected a BAN on gay marriage and then passed a law that legalizes it. It was put on the ballot in 2012 is three states and the majority of the voters in all three states voted in favor of it. You're living in the past Joe. 🙂

  5. "Marriage is a heterosexual institution. It will not work for same sex couples." Wrong! Gay people have been getting married in several countries for more than a decade and for the most part, those marriages have been as successful, if not more so than heterosexual marriages.

    "It is only an issue because gay people are using the COURTS to force the issue." Wrong! Several states put it on the ballot in 2012 & it passed. Other states legalized it.

    Thanks for the jock strap analogy. LOL!

  6. Put it to a vote in every state? The majority should not decide on the rights of a minority. If we did there'd still be slavery and women wouldn't be allowed to vote.

    No one if forcing gay marriage "on the rest of" you Joe. If you don't want a gay marriage, don't get gay married.

    Marriage used to be a contract that dealt with money, property and title. Women were chattel, nothing more. Marriage has been "redefined" to make them partners, not chattel. It's been "redefined" countless times.

  7. You're confusing civil law with biblical law. According to you lot, [email protected] sex in considered a perversion. An ABOMINATION. Not according to civil law. Funnily enough it's the Red States, with the highest concentration of evangelicals, that have the highest rates of porn consumption of out-of-wedlock births. You might think you get to determine what's perverse but you don't seem to practice what you preach.

    "Marriage was and is still between a man and a woman." Wrong! The world's changing Joe.

  8. Mildred Loving disagrees with you. So do the majority of Americans.

    “I believe all Americans, no matter their race, no matter their sex, no matter their sexual orientation, should have that same freedom to marry. Government has no business imposing some people’s religious beliefs over others, especially if it denies people’s civil rights.” – Mildred Loving, speaking out for marriage equality on June 12, 2007, the 40th anniversary of the Loving v. Virginia announcement.

  9. "Marriage is a heterosexual institution. It will not work for same sex couples. It is like putting a jock strap on a woman." LMAO! That was one of best that he's come up with. And by "best" I mean – ridiculous. You actually CAN put a jock strap on a woman. My sister wears one when she plays field hockey. You can put a jock strap on a woman and gays can get married. I wonder how old Joe is. My evangelical grandma is more with it than him and she's 95. She was a flower girl at my wedding!

  10. And I choose to be as I was born. Gay. You weren't born a bigot or a christian. That is how you chose to be. I don't care really. If that's how you choose to live your life, so be it. Just keep it to yourself.

  11. "I think you will find that most people think it is wrong."

    What's wrong is the way your mind works. Unless you've been living in a cave for the past decade you should know that support for gays and same-sex marriage is at an all-time high. The majority of Americans are supporters. With the younger generation, support rises to above 70%. Perhaps within your circle of influence that's not the case but thankfully – THANK GOD – you and yours don't make the laws or control out destinies.

  12. Wrong, wrong and wrong again. Not very long ago you anti-equality types said, "Put it on the ballot. Put it on the ballot!" If California rejected it, every other state would. Or so you thought. The only reason Prop 8 passed in California was because of the powerful push it got from the Mormon church. Now that they've back off, marriage equality is coming full steam ahead. "Put it on the ballot!"
    They did in 3 states and it passed in 3 states. Now you've changed your tune. 😉

  13. That's your problem. You're old. You think like an old person and you're very set in your ways. The younger generation, thankfully, isn't like you.

    You think I care if you or anyone else accepts me or my marriage? You might worry about such things but I don't. That's the thing. I've learned not to care what others think. The only reason I bother will trolls like you is that I want younger gay people to know that there's a life out there to be had, living proudly and openly. It gets better.

  14. I had a choice and I chose it. I could have chosen to live in the closet and be afraid of my own shadow, like you, but I chose a different path. I chose be honest and open about being gay. I don't "shove it in people's faces" as you types like to accuse us of, but I certainly don't pretend I'm something I'm not to please others. You should try it sometime. Maybe you'd find some happiness.

  15. Marriage isn't defined by someone's sexual preferences. Or is it? Those on your side of the argument used to say that it was only for procreation, until we pointed out that it wasn't. Let's just say that marriage was solely about procreation. Were that the case, it would be about sexual preference. Man likes woman – man prefers woman – man and woman make baby. In my case it'd be: man likes man – man prefers man – man and man try to make baby. Fail. Try again. We're "practicing" homosexuals.

  16. Are you one of those "ex-gays" we hear so much about? You certainly have the M.O. of one. You spend A LOT of time arguing against gay marriage, and are allegedly a male judging by your screen name – although your screen name says that you have "common sense" as well, and you don't…so, you might be female. Most likely not. Most likely male and closeted or "ex-gay." I have lots of straight males in my circle of influence and I can tell you this – no straight man is this concerned about gays.

  17. Not at all. The government of Canada made marriage equality the law of the land in 2005 – it was legal in some provinces as early as 2003 – and people just accepted it. They might not have liked or agreed with it but the nation didn't revolt. The majority of Americans are in favor of gays couples have an equal right to marriage, there will not be a backlash in the U.S. either. If the SCOTUS overturns DOMA [as they should because it's unconstitutional], America will survive. You will also.

  18. When marriage equality was made law of the land in Canada in 2005, none of the "scary" predictions made by people like Joe came to fruition. Anti-gays weren't FORCED to accept gay marriage. Religious people weren't persecuted for their objection to gay marriage. Life went on The only thing that changed was that gay couples finally had the same rights to marriage as straight couples.

    Fear of the unknown, that's the problem with Joe and those of his ilk. The lies they tell are what bother me.

  19. If homosexuals thought that what they did was wrong, they would not do it. To say that you know them better than they do is, frankly, bigotry.

  20. Shorter lifespans, higher suicide rate, or let's just group it all up as depression, can all be explained by people getting harassed due to intolerance.
    No, lying to yourself is pretty much impossible by definition, and you can't convince yourself of something. Beliefs and values are not conscious choices.

  21. That's bullshit. All of the homosexuals I've met were just as happy as anyone else, and that's probably because I live in a country where no one gives a damn.
    People that say "I won't get cancer" are not lying to themselves. They could either believe that they could get cancer, but they're lying about whether they believe it or not. Or, they're just not intelligent enough to understand how chance works, which is fairly common among humans. Actually, it's very common.

  22. Anybody that owns a business should be able to choose who they provide service to.  If you don't agree with gay marriage, you shouldn't HAVE to bake them a cake. This is where we determine that gay marriage threatens our religious freedom, because that gay couple is then going to file a lawsuit and shut that business down rather than simply going to another bakery for their cake. This is completely stripping the bakery of its religious freedom.  

  23. Bottum line, yes, gay marriage does restrict religious freedom.

    By saying that gay marriage does not undermine religious freedom, you have actually proven the opposite. You have simply redefined religious freedom to fit your opinion.

    You're right that people tend to confuse legal marriage with religious marriage. People seem to think that just because they have the right to get civilly married, they now have the right to force everyone to support them.

    I'm not infringing on anybody's freedom simply for refusing to do business with them unless that business involves their immediate safety such as some life saving medical procedure. In that case, if someone else is available to perform the treatment, no problem. Refusing to make a wedding cake does not infringe on your rights. Forcing me to make one is a violation of mine.

    This is the main reason why I don't support gay marriage being legally recognized. Just recently a baker refused to make a wedding cake for a gay couple. He allowed them to buy whatever they wanted from his bakery. They could enter the facility and order something just like any of the heterosexual customers. They could even ask the baker to make customized cakes for any occasion except their wedding, because he did not support gay marriage. They could've gotten their cake made somewhere else, however he was forced by court order to make the cake which he still has not done. He has said that he is willing to be jailed for his religious beliefs if necessary, and yes, that is what he would be jailed for.

    I can already see the replies to my comment saying, "Noone has been jailed for their religious beliefs. You're so ignorant!" He might be jailed for practicing his beliefs. Saying that someone can think whatever they want as longas they don't do anything about it is bullshit. What if someone said that to you? Be as gay as you want as long as you don't act on it. Have all the dirty fantacies you want about other guys, but keep their dicks out of your mouth. "HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT YOU WORTHLESS BIGGOT!" Exactly.

    You know, one guy commented ona different video by claiming that Christians, by demanding the right to refuse service, are demanding the right to punch someone in the face. He said, "If my religion tells me to punch people in the face, then according to your logic, refusing to allow me to punch you in the face would violate my rights." It's not an exact quote, but that's close enough.

    That's not right though. Assaulting people is not the same as refusing to make a cake.

    In Massachusetts, a gay couple wanted to adopt a baby from a Christian organization. They refused.

    You can argue all day long about how great gay parents are. Too bad, this agency didn't believe it was a good idea for a child to be raised by gay parents, so they refused. The couple, of course, sued, and the organization was forced by court order to provide the couple with a baby. They instead stopped offering adoption services in Massachusetts.

    Bottum line, yes, gay marriage does restrict religious freedom.

  24. Gay people, in order to be provocative and to limit freedom of religion, demand that a cake be made by a certain bakery whose owners do not want to sanction unholy, unnatural unions by baking that cake and putting two statues of men on top of it. So gay marriage is a threat to religious freedom, John. The story above is a case in point. 

  25. Im sure you can also expain away beastiality
    this guy mind is set to his own way..
    our comments will not change him but our prayers will
    thanks for coming out now I know who to pray for

  26. Liberals opposed slavery. Liberals opposed segregation. Liberals oppose anti-gay legislation. Liberals oppose legislation diminishing a woman's rights to make her own decisions about  reproductive health issues. Liberals support access to voting without unnecessary ways to discourage voting. Liberals support equality. Tolerance for the intolerant is not a liberal value. You got us there!

  27. Do you think freedom of religion in the US contitution gives religious videographers the right to discriminate against being hired by porn producers to film people engaging in sex? Do you think people in the US should be forced to do things they don't want to do?

  28. wow, you were so ahead of your time. Now Republicans are using the religious freedom argument. However, there is NO WHERE in the bible that states gays should not have jobs, thus should be fired if employed or be denied services by those who are "Christians" this is a fact. It's sad how they managed to convince so many people to just discriminate against people.

  29. The TRUE God of the Bible? WHO IS THAT? – Is that the God who demands that I believe He exists, or else He sends me to hell? Or is it the God who mass murders little babies to teach their parents a lesson? Or maybe the God who creates people imperfectly but expects them to be perfect? Or is it the God who teases and tricks a pair of teenagers, then curses them to eventual death, even though He knew from the start how it all ends? Or is it the God who commanded Noah and his family to preach to the people who rejected the message…for 50 or 100 years, knowing not one would listen and all would be washed away with the flood? – Sorry but any of the above actions disqualify your God from being deserving of my respect. Your God is a bizarre monster who clearly was created by a horrible human. – NOT INTERESTED, and just not dumb enough to believe such ignorant nonsense. – I embrace my mortality. I love my life. I have no problem with REALITY.

  30. I think that religions attitude to people being gay is why religion is in decline. Religion's attitude to gay people is a threat to themselves.

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