West Wing-Take Out the Trash Day-Gay Rights
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I saw this and started to cry (which is a huge deal for me). A father is talking about how his son was murdered for being gay (it was pretty much the equivalent to …
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West Wing-Take Out the Trash Day-Gay Rights
Considering that the United Kingdom, Canada, Israel, Australia, South Africa, Albania, Argentina, China, France, the Philippines, Russia, Romania, Switzerland, Sweden, Spain, New Zealand, and Japan, among others, already allow gay and lesbian members of their armed forces to serve openly, it is quite simply embarrassing that the United States – supposedly the arbiter of freedom and the shining light of democracy and equal rights in the world – does not.
All I can say is, it's about damn time.
@simplystreeptacular I couldn't agree more! I have two siblings in the armed forces & they are in an uproar that DADT was repealed because they're extremely homophobic & unaccepting of people & change. I feel like we Americans are filthy hypocrites regarding equal rights. We claim to be the "land of the free" where "all men are created equal", yet our legislation treats the GLBTQ community, handi-capable people, immigrants, & women as second-class citizens! It's infuriating! >:(
This reminds me of how my father feels. I'm gay and my father loves me regardless. He also served two tours in Vietnam. My father also voted for Obama and he won' again b/c of Obama's "weak-ass stance" on gay rights.
@trysill Are the people in the other party not a lot worse when it comes to positioning themselves on gay rights? I'm in Ireland, I always thought the the Republicans were the ones who were legislatively nasty to gays and lesbians..
wow
@younghoss hey, thanks for taking the time to discuss, I truly find American politics intriguing to watch from abroad. The reason I asked was just because of all the coverage I've seen of the Republican candidates for President, they seem to be very anti-gay rights. Even the moderate guy, I think it's Romney, did a u-turn on his previous position as a Governor concerning gays to cater for the so-called 'values voters'. I even remember Reps booing a serving gay soldier at one Rep. debate!
@simplystreeptacular -My Drill Instructor in the armed forces – was gay – and would be the only DI that would watch us shower, make us stand naked and would stare at us and even feel up our arms and chest saying "your getting strong" – we thought he was gay but were recruits in the military – he was caught and discharged a year later – can you blame me for my apprehension?
@KelpStalker I was robbed and beaten up by a black guy once(true story) should I be weary about all blacks now? Should I assume the worst whenever I see a black person? Something to think about. Don't let one experience get in the way of your better judgement for life.
@kalloused – massive difference,a Drill Instructor is someone you MUST obey, fear, respect and hopefully look up to. They are given massive authority and trust (not a random African American) – I like gay men, many are my friends, but if they are going to serve then we need to be realistic about the problems. Would we put a straight guy in a shower yelling at naked female recruits? it's not about being enlightened, but honest.
@KelpStalker EVERYONE is someone you hopefully want to befriend,respect and hopefully lookup to. One bad experience with you is no difference that what I had. It shouldn't stop you from looking at gays in the military as it should me from making black friends,dating black women,reading black lit,or having black role models.
Thats a great idea!
Again, this actor is amazing. And watching it again I have to say, so is the actress playing his wife. So subtle and so highly charged.
BAM! Just Got Sorkin'd! Sorkin'd! Quick Talk!
"Mostly straight"??? ….. What exactly is "mostly straight"?
Is that like being "Kind of or a little bit pregnant"?
Didn't the Israeli Army have men and women serve in close proximity, such as in combat roles and not just combat service and support roles?
In any case, you are merely throwing out one stupid guy problem for another. There has never been a single case of a gay man raping a straight man in the military. Not one. Never happened. Now, you go onto comparing it to having women and men showering together?
Yes. Why not. Grow the fuck up. Aren't you supposed to be a goddamned adult when you join?
Only if you all came forward when it happened. You didn't. Apprehension? According to you, you were molested. And apparently not just you. Are you the kind of person who lets the cause of justice fly over your head? Good thing you're not a teacher or coach or someone that I have to trust my kid around. You are clearly not capable of doing the "right thing" when it matters.
Oh, and what was your DI's name? I'd like to check it out with the DoD. See, I think you're a Christian Republican.
Hey there Jim, got a bit of a temper there eh? Speaking of Power – thats's exactly what the Drill Instructor used. – I will answer both your posts and responses here. It was the power that my gay DI used to have us drop our towels. Not sure youtube would allow us to post names or numbers but you are welcome to come try and kick my teeth in, funny how strong people get on the internent.
As for why I did not say anything, I did not know he was gay until after platoon 3079 graduated. I was stationed elsewhere and we found out when he was outed by his former bf. I have no problem with gays in the military – he was a great Marine, but he abused his power, plain, simple and sad.
His name, His name was Drill Instructor Staff Sgt. Thomspson, he was nominated in 1985 for Marine of the Year, lost it all when he was kicked out. FYI I am a coach and a teacher and good at both.
I actually agree, just make sure that everyone KNOWS so no one can be taken advantage of.
Sure. I was in the Army myself. I always enjoy it when people yammer on about a statement made in a non-serious manner and attempt to be all civil about it. Fun, huh? As for the rest, I guess you're outed as a conservative Christian. I'm sure you are all good with gays in the military. And it could be that he abused his power. Don't tar all with the same brush. Except I can when it comes to conservative Christians. They all wear the same clothing. The clothing of lies and bigotry.
I LOVE that you said that. A family member of mine said that when you enter the military nothing matters other than the men & women standing next you.
The truly horrible part about that though is that both of my brothers are in the military & they say that DADT might as well not have been repealed because no one comes out because they know people will gladly kick their ass for it, or their backs won't be covered anymore in a dangerous situation. Neither of my brothers would ever do that (beat up someone or endanger them by not protecting them) despite them being enormously homophobic pricks, but it's still incredibly common. 🙁
Despite that comment being on "Jerry Spiringer", I think it's amazing & true. 🙂 Every reputable psychological study in the past 20 years says sexual orientation is primarily decided by the age of 6 and is fluid & fluctuates throughout a person's lifetime. Whether that means someone will explore intimacy with other genders or just different taste in sexual needs is a case by case basis.
In that case, yes, your DI's behavior was deplorable, but IT WAS YOUR DUTY TO REPORT HIM! If you were uncomfortable, you should've told someone. Even if you found it personally embarrassing to do so, you should've done the right thing. Imagine the absolutely miniscule possibility your DI did something bad to someone. You establishing a pattern for him could help protect others. I've gone through things like that & it sucks, but it's the right thing to do.
I'm sorry, but gay, straight, tall, short, or green, YOU SHOULD HAVE REPORTED HIM! I know that someone can be a spectacular soldier & a great friend & you really don't want to do anything to tarnish his/her reputation, but you have to remember, that if he were to happen to someone else & you hadn't told someone that he was prone to misconduct, then what happened to that other person is on your conscience. The actions of 1 shouldn't influence your feelings of an entire group of people.
Oh god. Mitt Romney makes me ashamed to call myself American. If he wins the election, I swear I'm leaving the country! I have no idea how, but I am. His idea of liberty is pretty much taking away everyone's freedom that he doesn't agree with, &/or preventing them from getting equal rights in the 1st place. He'd set back women 3 decades & completely destroy the tiny steps we've made in gay rights in the past 5 years. I'd hate for people to look at him & think that's what all Americans are like.
I remember the crowd booing the soldier too & I literally (no exaggeration) SCREAMED at my television set. Gay or straight, man or woman, NO ONE who serves in the US Armed Forces should EVER be booed! Even if they're fighting an unjustified war, they're protecting us in the way they've been told to & putting themselves at great risk for us to do what they believe is right. I'd kick the ass of anyone that booed my brothers!
Republicans tend to base the majority of their beliefs off of conservative Christian values (which goes against everything in the US Constitution). They mostly strive to deny people rights that they don't agree with on the grounds of "family values" or "strong morals". They try to deny gay people every right imaginable & set back women's rights at least 20 years. I pray Mitt Romney doesn't get elected because my rights as a woman virtually vanish under his desired administration.
You and your father are lucky that you weren't part of the cause of a serious reduction in gay rights. Obama has done MANY TIMES more for gay rights than all other presidents combined, much better than any Republican could ever accomplish, and it's not good enough? People like you make me shake my fucking head.
You lost me on this one, slayerchick. There are very evil people in the military, just like there are very evil people in all other walks of life. To say that NO ONE who serves should EVER be booed is just flat out wrong. I wouldn't boo them just because they fought in the Iraq war. The reason for that is that even though it was an immoral, illegal, dishonest, stupid war, there probably wasn't enough evidence of that from the beginning. However, NO ONE?? That's just stupid and wrong. Sorry.
Very well said.
I guess you're right about my blanket declaration of "no one". There are some truly evil people there. I was referring more to people that serve in the US Military with genuine good intentions & a desire to help others. Those people shouldn't be booed. Unfortunately, a lot of service men & women were greatly mislead about certain facts regarding the war in Iraq. The people that deliberately conspired to mislead them in order to get them to believe in the cause & enlist should definitely be booed
Though I disagree personally, I know a lot of people that felt that way. When you think about it, even if things aren't equal as promised, you can bet your ass things would be much worse under Republican leadership (I say that as a daughter & granddaughter of Republican politicians). Also, remember The President can't pass laws himself. The GOP in the House & Senate saw to the failing of most of the equality bills attempted to be passed. Lots of thing must be done on a state level as well.
I completely agree. My father & grandfather were both long-standing Republican politicians (no, I'm not kidding), & my father is quite open about the fact that even if a Republican politician is not homophobic (which my family definitely is) they will never support a marriage-equality bill. But remember, The President can't pass laws. The House & Senate does. The Republicans have the majority there & have seen to it everything equality-related (even equal pay for women) were squashed. >:(
I used to be LDS, & that's definitely the policy. The general belief in the LDS church is that if God gives you a baby, you're supposed to have it. Even if you've been raped by a family member! They say "It's a blessing you receive from a bad situation." They say if your child or you are supposed to survive God's test, you will. Even if you're told by a doctor your child will for sure be still-born, the church says you should still give birth to it. I know 3 people personally that have done that
The DSM IV (The manuals used by psychologists & psychiatrists to treat & diagnose people) says that people that display severe homophobic feelings like you are secretly repressing homosexual desires & tendencies in themselves. So, look into your heart & see if there's anything valid in that. Go screw a girl & see how you feel. Also, God said, "Judge not lest ye be judged." You're going to get God's displeasure. Though I disagree with you, I still love you & acknowledge you're a child of God.
And yet under the (n)Obama presidency we've seen DADT be repealed, that's one hell of a leap for US LGBTs.
btw. this is one of the best scenes in the first season of the West Wing.
This show was light years ahead…
"Lady, I'm not embarrassed my son was gay, my government is."
This country fucking disappoints men like Mr. Lydell
Some of the most fervent supporters of gay rights I've ever seen were veterans. "If you can pick up a rifle, I couldn't give a shit who you love."